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General Category => Modellers At Work => Topic started by: Les Tindall on June 14, 2020, 01:49:52 PM



Title: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on June 14, 2020, 01:49:52 PM
Sorry about the intriguing title. My latest project is an 18inch gauge loco used on the Woolwich Arsenal in east London.  This strange thing (called "Lachesis" - that's a Greek religious word - had to google that one!) was the second internal combustion loco in the UK (and only the third in the world). It was an 0-4-0 built by Ruston in 1896 using an Ackroyd single cylinder nine-and-a-half h.p. oil-engine, the first of four (the others were 2-4-0's). They were somewhat underpowered and only lasted a few years (all were scrapped by 1920).  Very little information is available, just a few rather grainy photos, the only drawing (a side elevation) is full of inaccuracies. What looks like a vertical boiler at the front is in fact the cooling system.   Definitely a challenge.  I'll keep you informed of progress.  Scale is 16mm (1/19th).     
Les Tindall


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Bill Gill on June 14, 2020, 02:40:00 PM
Les, that looks and sounds like  a fun challenge.
About your intriguing subject line, when I read the name "Lachesis", Loch Ness immediately came to mind > "Monster" rather than "beast" :)


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on June 14, 2020, 08:57:31 PM
By all means keep us posted on your progress. -- Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Gordon Ferguson on June 15, 2020, 11:02:43 AM
Hi Les, seem to remember Barney had a go at this one as well , in 1/24 ?

Think he gave up on it due to the frustration of trying to get anymore info ?


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: 5thwheel on June 15, 2020, 12:21:08 PM
Sometimes when you are lacking all the information you have take a wild guess and then fake it.   ;)


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on June 15, 2020, 12:38:23 PM
This is as far as I got + a set of wheels and a bucket full of gears + a head ache
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on June 15, 2020, 12:44:19 PM
Trying !!


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on June 15, 2020, 12:47:46 PM
Getting there -I think


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on June 15, 2020, 12:55:52 PM
Hope Les can work this one out Im already Thinking about having another go at this little beast
Barney
Just fiddling with the camera I think Im getting there -


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on June 16, 2020, 02:51:02 AM
Bill, I think there will be quite a bit of "faking" on this project - still I'm having fun (so far) and no one can check with the actual engine.
Barney, that's the side elevation that has the errors (positioning of suspension, linkage from the brake column, etc).
Working on the suspension at the moment so should have some progress pics next week.
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on June 16, 2020, 03:02:52 PM
Les - yes I see what you mean - Not sure where I got that drawing- No wonder it give me a head ache  - still no one knows anything about it so it makes things easier
and keeping us happy is the important bit
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on June 16, 2020, 08:36:42 PM
Even so, you guys have an unusual advantage: If you both plan to build a model you can help each other figure out what to correct and how best to fake what remains. It would be the first time on this forum that two guys wanted to build models of the same thing at about the same time. I, for one, would find the construction thread fascinating since you'd probably be consulting with each other all the way through. -- Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Ray Dunakin on June 16, 2020, 09:58:24 PM
What an unusual beast, and a very interesting project!


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on June 18, 2020, 02:42:56 AM
Progress is coming along quite rapidly.  The suspension is now complete all from styrene strip and rod.  It sits at an angle because of the "fore and back" movement the single cylinder, slow revving, large flywheel drive would produce. It would probably be like being on a ship in a rough sea!   If the springs were in the usual position the movement would produce considerable stresses in the metal and possibly shear any vertical supports.

The wheels (24mm dia 3D printed ones from the bits box) are just loosely slipped onto the axles, though not much will be seen of them as the loco frames are just 2 or 3 inches off the top of the rails at their lowest point.
 
Barney has been in touch and says he has found info on the complex gearing system, which will be a help.

Next stage is the cooling cylinder at the front.

Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on June 18, 2020, 02:53:15 AM
The other side


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on June 18, 2020, 01:33:51 PM
Nothing wrong with that start. -- Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on June 18, 2020, 03:18:09 PM
Looking Good Les a great start - I'm still trying to work things out but have now got a few drawings of the chassis of course with a bit of modellers licence
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Ray Dunakin on June 20, 2020, 12:11:52 AM
Great start!


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on July 01, 2020, 04:40:07 AM
Making slow progress, its 80% thinking, 20% actual modelling!   The large single cylinder of the oil engine is installed (other bits to add to it at a later date), along with the flywheels/con rod.  The flywheels are made from laminated styrene sheet cut roughly to size then turned on a dremel firstly with a small chisel then sandpaper.  The frames are painted acrylic dark blue (which will be weathered down later). The colour scheme was a subject of great debate between Barney and myself as obviously no colour photos exist, but he had some references which indicated this may have been the colour prior to WW1
Next stage will be the gears.  That will take even more thinking!.
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on July 01, 2020, 01:11:46 PM
The Blue turned out nice - and the gear box well what can I say - it will keep you awake all night
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on July 01, 2020, 01:24:42 PM
Adequate.

As Les ponders his next step, Barney should be building his own version. But you have let us down, Barney; you are just commenting from the peanut gallery like I am. Go stand in the corner.

Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on July 01, 2020, 02:49:23 PM
After spending some time in the horizonal position (its supposed to help the flow of blood to the brain) plus a glass or two (or three) of Australian Chardonnay I have figured out the gearing system.  The biggest headache was trying to work out how they reversed the drive on the beast.  Anyway it utilises bevel gears.  Now being able to sleep tonight I have come to the conclusion that modelling is still fun!
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on July 01, 2020, 02:54:14 PM
But-err - no excuse - I will stand in the corner - Still scale hopping back to 1/35th !!!!
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Ray Dunakin on July 02, 2020, 12:14:21 AM
Awesome! I love the blue, really looks good on it.


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Bernhard on July 03, 2020, 02:12:15 AM
Great work, Les. I like the paint job. It turns a plastic model into a real thing.
Bernhard


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Bill Gill on July 03, 2020, 06:29:23 AM
It has weight. I like the blue too.


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: 1-32 on July 04, 2020, 01:23:08 PM
Hi Les.
Very interesting subject and a great start with such an interact  frame.
cheers


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on July 12, 2020, 06:03:49 AM
More progress, all the gearing is now in place, next part will be the coupling rods.  The gears came from a cheap pack (81 in the pack!) of plastic gears from China at just 4.60 ($5.50) including postage!!!  They came within days too. A good selection of sizes enabled me to fit the gears about as the prototype photos looked. The only difficult one was the large gear with the slots in. This had to have some styrene strips added and the slots carefully cut out and filed to shape as per the original loco.  The strange contraption on the top of the gears holds the vertical gear the is part of the reversing mechanism of the loco. The clutch (just about visible in a very crowded area of the engine - remember it is just 18 inch gauge) came from the bits box, a metal disc of just the right size.  The clutch on the prototype was operated by a long lever from the cab, pushing against a moveable tube (in the centre of the disc by the large slotted gear) which then disengaged the drive and also allowed (via another lever) a gear wheel to move up against the vertical gear suspended from that contraption above the gears.  I hope that makes sense, its all a bit "Heath Robinson" but obviously worked.
More progress shots in a couple of weeks.
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on July 12, 2020, 01:35:55 PM
Looking great Les - and all them gears /cogs between a 18in frame amazing !
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on July 12, 2020, 02:36:03 PM
Compared to figuring out how the gears work and then how to replicate them, the actual construction must have seemed simple. At this stage, things appear adequate. -- Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Chuck Doan on July 12, 2020, 10:14:07 PM
That's looking great Les!


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: 1-32 on July 13, 2020, 02:17:24 AM
Great progress there Les, the colour makes all the difference.
cheers


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Bernhard on July 16, 2020, 02:06:29 AM
It is a mature achievement to reproduce such a complicated mechanism with so little documentation.
Bernhard


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on July 16, 2020, 02:27:54 AM
Thanks for all the comments guys.  It's certainly a "head scratching" model. After getting past the complex gears part went on to start the coupling rods. Something I thought would be simple and straightforward took four attempts, 1: too thick a looking piece of styrene, 2: axle hole too large, 3: modelling knife cut in wrong place,4: success!!    Perhaps I should take up knitting instead, pass another valium please!

Les       


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: shropshire lad on July 16, 2020, 09:23:00 AM
Thanks for all the comments guys.  It's certainly a "head scratching" model. After getting past the complex gears part went on to start the coupling rods. Something I thought would be simple and straightforward took four attempts, 1: too thick a looking piece of styrene, 2: axle hole too large, 3: modelling knife cut in wrong place,4: success!!    Perhaps I should take up knitting instead, pass another valium please!

Les       

Here ya go , Les ....


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on July 16, 2020, 01:02:12 PM
Actually, drugs are always the answer! -- ssuR


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on July 16, 2020, 02:35:15 PM
Do you really want to end up looking like our Max -quote from Ray "looks like he has been on a bender" (see blue note room )
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on July 17, 2020, 01:20:38 AM
I already look like that. -- Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on July 17, 2020, 03:33:28 AM
Thanks for the magazine Nick, didn't know you were into knitting, problem now is what scale to make that scarf!
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Lawton Maner on July 17, 2020, 08:03:45 AM
Make it a 3X and mail it to Russ.

Headed to the corner.  Move over Nick.


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on July 28, 2020, 07:37:09 AM
A couple of quick progress shots. The cooling "tower" is now complete. On the original there was a spiral of pipework which water flowed through to cool the cylinder (thats the small pipe going down to the cylinder, the large pipe is the exhaust). Its a bit front heavy at the moment but should balance out when the rest of the "cab" detail is added. The water pump has been fitted on the far side of the cylinder, now working on the control gear (forward/reverse and clutch levers). Progress has stalled a bit as my local model shop is still closed so having to mail order stuff.  At only a 7 minute walk away it was useful for that odd bit of styrene needed for a specific part. I've decided to mount the whole "beast" on a low-loader on the diorama (in the background) as though it is being shipped away somewhere, Shapeways came up with some wheels I can modify to represent solid-tyred wheels on a "knock-out" rear axle of a vintage low loader.
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on July 28, 2020, 07:37:46 AM
another shot


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on July 28, 2020, 12:45:12 PM
Coming along well and a very good addition to the diorama. -- Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on July 28, 2020, 02:49:56 PM
Well its  defiantly comes into the "odd bod category " but its an excellent  bit of model building
Barney


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Bernhard on August 02, 2020, 03:17:12 AM
Your model gets better and better with every step.

Bernhard


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on August 02, 2020, 05:17:50 AM
Thanks Bernhard
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Ray Dunakin on August 02, 2020, 07:21:18 PM
Beautiful work! I really like that color.


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on August 18, 2020, 02:41:32 AM
Finished. Now starting work on the low-loader to carry it.
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on August 18, 2020, 02:42:29 AM
 Sorry forgot the photo


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on August 18, 2020, 04:04:59 AM
Wasn't happy wit the photo against a whiter background, so here is another (though had to reduce the resolution quite a lot for it to load onto the forum)
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Ray Dunakin on August 18, 2020, 12:14:15 PM
I love it! What a cool, unusual looking loco, and you did a fine job on it!


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on August 18, 2020, 12:52:39 PM
I'm with Ray; most satisfactory.

If you photograph it again, use more light. For example, shoot it outdoors or on a table right next to a window (but don't also use a lamp if you do that).

Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on August 19, 2020, 02:52:18 AM
Russ, if I photo it outside I will probably get comments from the neighbours such as " its that wierdo taking pictures of bits of plastic". 
Seriously though, thanks for the advice, I've done the photos outside n the past so should restart doing it again.
Les


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Bill Gill on August 19, 2020, 05:12:35 AM
Les, I doubt they'd recognize any of that as plastic :)
It came out very nice! Kike Ray said, good color, good work.


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Bernhard on August 19, 2020, 08:18:00 AM
Good job, Les. I always find those bizarre technical solutions fascinating.

Bernhard


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: finescalerr on August 19, 2020, 01:58:44 PM
To protect you from your neighbors' prying eyes and petty comments, I have cleaned up your photo digitally so we better may appreciate the model. -- Russ


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Barney on August 19, 2020, 02:31:51 PM
 Another fine job Les and a most unusual loco it makes a change from the "norm black locos" looking forward to the low-loader now or is it just the beginning for another headache still its worth a slight banging in the head - nothing a swift liquid or two don't cure - if the end result ends up with models on this Forum that continue to such high standards .
Barney

e.g Swift liquids = a glass of water ! 


Title: Re: The Woolwich beast
Post by: Les Tindall on August 20, 2020, 01:39:22 PM
Thanks Russ, the only cleaning I do needs a mop and bucket!  I noticed that one of the levers connected to the clutch plate had come adrift, now fixed.
Barney the low loader is coming together very nicely, no headaches (so far).  I'll post it when completed.
Les