This might take a while because I am basically going to be experimenting with some textures both horizontally and vertically.
I have been playing with some track and have a basic concept worked out to include a single blade switch.
Michael
Looks like fun. -- Russ
Nice start, looks like it'll be an interesting project!
Nice job bending the flange rails against the grain!
Thanks Russ, hopefully I will be able to add some new ideas to the pool. Ray your own work has given me a lot of ideas over the years, so perhaps I can bring something new to the table. Chuck, glad you like the rail bending, tomorrow I will post a picture of the bender that I made. Your own work has given me many moments of wow how did he achieve that ? finding new ideas for the members of this forum will certainly be a big challenge given all the talent here, one of the reasons that this might take a while.
regards Michael
Looking forward to this!
I need to build a rail bender (for code 250) so I am anxious to see yours.
-Marty
Interesting project, but what scale is it?
Marty here is a picture and drawing of the rail bender.
Hauk the scale is 1:22.6 which is the old gauge 3 which I understand is having a bit of a revival in England. the gauge will be 63.5mm the rails that I am using are code 210 for the running rail and code 100 for the guard rail. the combination gives me a width of scale 4 inches over the running and guard rails.
One of my goals is to do some tests with the infill materials and use real concrete powder to formulate concrete textures and use clay to make and bake real bricks, because we cannot scale molecules it will be interesting to see what challenges come to the surface.
Michael
A little more work on the single blade. a scrap of .25 inch brass plate was first milled with a rebate .075 x .075 inch the the blade was sawn off with a jewelers saw with a #3 saw blade it took 45 minutes to cut.
Then it was filed to shape to fit the curved rail and the circular button.
After soldering them together the slot was milled into the button and the cleaned up a bit.
Michael
Darn good work!
Thanks Ray
I am doing some experiments with creosoted wood setts, first test is to get a sense of what they would look like and the proportions, these are still wet so the colour is still very black. the wood is very fine grained cedar. dropped into some dilute Tamiya black then immediately plucked out with some tweezers to drain off. I like the idea of the wood sets I looked for some standard dimensions but they seem to be all over the map.
Michael
More work with the wood setts this picture (https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm6.staticflickr.com%2F5536%2F9815119926_eea738c1c8_b.jpg&hash=59f4e447968a665fc85ead4132f598262034b7fa) from this website http://www.roadswerenotbuiltforcars.com/wood/ (http://www.roadswerenotbuiltforcars.com/wood/)is the direction that i am looking to follow.
Michael
Very cool. I've never heard of wood being used as cobblestones -- quite interesting!
Hi Michael,
good to see you back posting!
This is going to be an interesting thread. The wooden cobblestones are a quite unusual item. Good choice! I've seen that in rather modern railway or streetcar workshops but never outdoors. Any idea which kind of wood they used? I think your modeling approach is good, but maybe you could sand the surface a bit to reduce the grain/fibers.
Cheers,
Volker
Very interesting wooden fill between the rails, a nice contrast in color and texture and an unexpected material and look. My initial thought when seeing the blocks in the first photo was they were short pieces you dyed just to economical test the coloring technique.
Volker Thanks for your feedback, overall I think that you have nailed the thoughts that I have been having regarding the grain. The wood setts are first cut to the cross section on the table saw, then the only sane and safe way to cut them into the 6 inch high blocks is to use a small mitre-box.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6910x800_zpsazy0ucvf.jpg&hash=c1a39616d8f6eb9a123d213b5e223c2d70b73372) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6910x800_zpsazy0ucvf.jpg.html)
The top surface is the straight cut surface, I have been locking up 32 at a time to sand the bottom to ensure that they are level but not so level to appear that they have been sanded
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6926x800_zpszymwittm.jpg&hash=f90422c6960b926a72e3c547c35546d3872e3c1a) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6926x800_zpszymwittm.jpg.html)
I will keep the ones I have already made as a batch of heavily weathered ones, typically these were replaced every 4-5 years in some locations. the Photograph showing the real tiles that still exist in London show a mix of smooth (most) with some heavy grain erosion on a few. The next batches, and realistically most of them I will add the sanding step and re-dye them I am also going to vary the dilution just a little to create a very soft variation in colour. I have looked at some photographs of some setts that have weathered to a more brown colour.
According to some of the old advertisements some of the wood used was Jarrah from Australia, in North America Fir was also used, which is what I am using, The key is to use very fine grained wood. Because of the porosity of the grain I have not left the blocks long in the Tamiya solution, if I leave them longer the solution with penetrate deeper into the wood which might be an advantage. I might also try some diluted India ink with alcohol. I am Working in small batches of a hundred or so at a time setting them up on top of the stove to dry. The next batch I will sand before setting them into the colorant The setts varied in size the ones listed on one of the historic drawings list them as 3 x 6 1/4 x 7 the blocks I have are 4 x 6 x6 high, the height is determined by the hieght of the rail. I had originally stated that the scale was 1:22.6. I changed that to 1:24 and have chosen the full gauge of 4 foot 8 1/2 inches for the width between the rails which turns out to be 2.354" exactly. 2 1/2" gauge would be used for a practical operational running track. Obviously there are compromises when building models I am OK with the ones I have made.
I also want to add a section of the roadway that has been replaced with stone cobbles. I have been contemplating how to make these and what materials to make them from to realistically represent Granite, without trying to cut the real stuff which would most certainly send me off the the institution for those who have lost it.
I have thought about Corian and putting the blocks into a tumbler, also casting some cement fondue blocks and tumbling them. to create this effect shown in a link to the Manchester Corporate tramways on Wikipedia
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/95/Tram_lines_salford.jpg)
I do not want to cast a slab and carve them but rather lay them in the same way as the wooden setts.
Bill thanks for looking in and your thoughts.
Michael
At one time many American factory floors were made from wooden tile like the cobblestones represented here. The mail post office in Richmond, Virginia had a floor made from end grain maple blocks which resisted the attempt at destruction caused by lift trucks and steel wheeled mail trailers.
In aside note, Michael: I thought this forum was where people went once their modeling caused them to loose their sanity.
Lawton interesting note about the post office. It would no doubt have been a lot quieter than concrete as well.
A question for the experts out there, has anyone tried to use baked Sculpy for hard polished stone?
I am thinking that a form of squeeze mould might work to make cobbles out of a colored Sculpy mix then bake them. Once they are glued they could be polished or clear coated before adding the grout mix.
Michael
Very inspiring and different
Barney
Thanks Barney, I have added some setts now that have been sanded on the top surface. so fare there are 360 setts only a few thousand more to go. the third shot clearly shows the difference between the un-sanded and the sanded setts.
Mike
this morning I rolled out a sheet of Sculpy that is a mixed grayish color, then using a #11 xacto blade cut it into some 1/4 inch wide strips. I rounded the top a little with some rough card by lightly rolling back and forth over the top edge. then using the same #11 blade chopped the strip into approx 3 inch (scale ) loaves off the end of the strip, I am now waiting for my wife to pull the muffins out of the oven so that I can use the residual heat to bake the Sculpy then I will see how they stack up as cobbles. if this works i will do a S.B.S of the entire process.
Mike
I think that this method has definite potential
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6973x800_zpscomcxjob.jpg&hash=8bc523499f4535a937fd68e4347b6b013c979e84) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6973x800_zpscomcxjob.jpg.html)
The raw loaves of the Sculpy sliced off the long strip.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6974x800_zpsd3v2dens.jpg&hash=4a2711e887a8b549b475f2b22ffd5cb7c03bc220) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6974x800_zpsd3v2dens.jpg.html)
After they were baked
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6978x800_zpstrpfly6r.jpg&hash=632586399407017886193943cc4c39d91373762f) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6978x800_zpstrpfly6r.jpg.html)
a quick study on how they will lay up I am encouraged by the visual variation that will be achieved by the subtle variations in the cut blocks.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6981x800_zpsqansq27n.jpg&hash=b21b5307fc46d16d09ca4c7f01fcbbf7eb179378) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6981x800_zpsqansq27n.jpg.html)
I will be doing more experiments with the Scuply to determine the right color mix and sizes.
Michael
I am still working out the best way to make the blocks here are some more but are a little too rounded for this application
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6984x800_zpslnbjogpb.jpg&hash=5b0047f0c4ea086d3b6404c1c97d8826938455d8) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6984x800_zpslnbjogpb.jpg.html)
These are some that are less rounded and glued down to see how well they polish up, after sprinkling some Rembrandt chalks they were polished with some leather.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6987x800_zpsypft0uba.jpg&hash=42e046cf624ab29d9a8287f83cd85b81b0b9997f) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6987x800_zpsypft0uba.jpg.html)
Once the way of making the blocks is finalized I think that they will work quite well by mixing the colour in batches there will be very subtle variation in color on the polished surfaces.
Michael
They look very good ... and they should given all the work you have done. -- Russ
Hi Michael,
What a fascinating thread and subject per se. Many thanks also for the link to London's Forgotten Australian Timber Roads.
Your approach to the wooden cobblestone is very good indeed, and the sanding makes the result even better. Nice idea of using Sculpty for stone cobbles. Once, I have to try that myself.
However, in my humble opinion, your first quick study looks much better to me, because they don't look as uniformly as in the following trials.
Looking forward to your next post!
Peter
P.S. I can well remember your marvelous Kingfisher cutter. Did you finish it or ... I missed something? ???
Hi Michael,
Quote from: Peter_T1958 on October 10, 2015, 01:22:57 PMYour approach to the wooden cobblestone is very good indeed, and the sanding makes the result even better. [...] However, in my humble opinion, your first quick study looks much better to me, because they don't look as uniformly as in the following trials.
I'm completely with Peter. Well, now that I'm already in the corner I feel free to write this: The latest version of the cobblestones reminds me of a special kind of german bread: Kommissbrot (http://www.die-broetchentuete.de/kommissbrot-1000g-4762.html) ;D. It's been developed pre WWI for military purposes. During the baking process it's cobbled (https://www.ploetzblog.de/2011/01/25/kommissbroetchen/) indeed which results in the typical appearance. It's tasty - as long as they don't use saw dust like they did in WWI when grain was becoming scarce.
I think the shape is to even and the edges are to much rounded. As convincing the wooden parts are, the stones don't work too good. For the "A glimpse of the Plettenberger Kleinbahn" project I made some trials with wood putty (http://www.molto.de/produkt/molto-holz-fein-spachtel/) mixed with black pigments and some stone dust/sand. The putty gives a rather smooth surface. I have another approach because I think it is not necessary to use single stones. I emboss the putty with a joints shaped punch (a putty layer of 4 or 5 mm is sufficient). To achieve a somewhat rounded surface (indeed I feel that most cobblestones are not too much rounded) a piece of clingfilm between putty and punch brings good results, but even the punch itself leads to minimal rounded stones. A combination of both kinds of embossment and some reworking with a stiff brush and a screwdriver or even with a stone's surface (I didn't try it, but Ray's approach with the stone walls is very inspiring) may lead to a not to monotonous result. Unfortunately I didn't document my trials so this is some kind of fishing in troubled water ::). Maybe one can even split the stones after the process to have single stones; don't know if that works.
Another point about the switch blade: All the rails seem to be of nickle silver, but the blade and the joint/button are of brass. As long as this is not going to be a functional model of course you may color it, but if so: Maybe you can add a layer of nickle silver to the accordingly milled top of the blade and the joint to have the same appearance as the rails? Tinning the remaining brass parts may add to this.
Great project!
Cheers,
Volker
Peter thanks for your considered positive comments.
Quoteyour first quick study looks much better to me, because they don't look as uniformly as in the following trials.
I do agree with you on this score,
The abandoned Manchester track picture that I posted is the type of look that I want to achieve.
Volker thanks for your knowledgeable and critical comments.
QuoteI think the shape is to even and the edges are to much rounded.
Yes I agree with you, again going back to the Manchester tracks I am struck by the uneven though polished surfaces of the stones.
QuoteI think it is not necessary to use single stones.
True, and it would be much faster. At this point I am feeling a bit like a dog with a bone and will continue with my pursuit of being able to generate the right look with individual stones. The very subtle randomness that can come from this approach is one of my goals.
QuoteAs long as this is not going to be a functional model of course you may color it,
My intention is to colour them, although I have considered using steel in order to get some uniform rust colours, your own work with the tracks for the bridgework almost caused me to just give up and go sit in the corner and take up knitting.
QuoteMaybe you can add a layer of nickle silver to the accordingly milled top of the blade and the joint to have the same appearance as the rails?
I will be getting back to the rails and will be ensuring that they are consistent in appearance.
Again thank you both for your good critical feedback.
Michael
continuing with the process of making individual blocks, I have texture the surfaces of the blocks when they were still in a strip form with first a roller that was made by indenting it by rolling a wooden dowel onto rough concrete under pressure. this caused the surface to have some protrusions. this was then impressed with some worn out 60 grit sandpaper which created indents in the surface of the strips.
The strips were then cut into setts with a #11 blade.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6990x800_zpstd9vukoh.jpg&hash=c60d2b53c8bcb4cdede3c4d73eaed020a4825afc) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6990x800_zpstd9vukoh.jpg.html)
After the glue had set I buffed the surface with some soft leather and again using chalks to fill the gaps.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_6999x800_zpsmt9cyyyj.jpg&hash=71c394a6f8ae0e0e889f639a3ec1346ae361984e) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_6999x800_zpsmt9cyyyj.jpg.html)
The surface although better is still missing the subtle polish that many of the photographs of real cobbled streets have, including the Manchester one. so I buffed the surface with some 1200 grit wet and dry sandpaper then rebuffed with the leather and dusted and rebuffed.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi5.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy169%2Fmy30mm%2F0%2520tram%2520diorama%2FIMG_7000x800_zpsu5fw12hz.jpg&hash=dc0dfba1222f861cb5499675c04d59b810dd9d0f) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/my30mm/media/0%20tram%20diorama/IMG_7000x800_zpsu5fw12hz.jpg.html)
Now I feel that I am getting somewhere.
Michael
Michael,
this is an imressive improvement, looks like you nailed it. About the polish: You may try graphite powder as last step, but prior to chalking the joints.
I always asked myself when the polished appearance of the cobblestones commenced. I think this is a rather newer phenomenon resulting from car tires, but the steel tires of horse drawn carriages and horseshoes may have caused the wear at the stones' surface, but back then the stones might have looked rather a bit dulled from the remaining dust.
Quote from: michael mott on October 11, 2015, 01:27:39 PM
QuoteI think it is not necessary to use single stones.
True, and it would be much faster. At this point I am feeling a bit like a dog with a bone and will continue with my pursuit of being able to generate the right look with individual stones. The very subtle randomness that can come from this approach is one of my goals.
The result speaks for itself.
Quote from: michael mott on October 11, 2015, 01:27:39 PM
QuoteAs long as this is not going to be a functional model of course you may color it,
My intention is to colour them, although I have considered using steel in order to get some uniform rust colours, your own work with the tracks for the bridgework almost caused me to just give up and go sit in the corner and take up knitting.
Come on. I didn't fabricate the steel tracks by myself. I was lucky to find someone who was willing and able to mill them for me. I would be happy if I had the technical possibilities and your manual skills. For the uniform rust colours you may use rust powder from fresh rusted steel to give it a final touch after burnishing. This works quite good. Otherwise - your knitting might have been of some interest, too :D.
Cheers,
Volker
Michael, your latest paving stones are definitely better than the first test 'german bread' variety. The texture and slight polishing and coloring are very good! I hesitate to comment, but since you have chosen to create and lay individual stones instead of embossing a pattern, (a most honorable decision) the stones themselves still have a very uniform overall shape compared to photos. The photos of streets in different countries reveal difference in how the stones are shaped and laid, but the individual stones themselves are a bit more irregular in shape along all sides. They have small, but noticeable protrusions and indentations and even slight variations in overall size where yours are more uniform and have pretty straight lines along the long sides.
http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/d6687edd181e464fbb64984c821c7a39/old-cobblestoned-street-with-historic-train-tracks-showing-in-the-s000kx.jpg
http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-cobblestoned-street-prague-czech-republic-8123239.html
http://thumb7.shutterstock.com/display_pic_with_logo/454618/102863369/stock-photo-cobblestone-street-wood-102863369.jpg
http://theweeklynabe.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/img_2355.jpg
http://www.123rf.com/photo_10554553_cobble-stone-road-pattern-from-prague.html
I added so many links because I am very hesitant to appear to be any kind of authority on this topic. Different stone, different times, different workers make it impossible to say there are not many places with stones like you have. I hope that is not overstepping. I would be thrilled to have created what you have.
Volker thanks for you further thoughts.
QuoteI always asked myself when the polished appearance of the cobblestones commenced. I think this is a rather newer phenomenon resulting from car tires, but the steel tires of horse drawn carriages and horseshoes may have caused the wear at the stones' surface, but back then the stones might have looked rather a bit dulled from the remaining dust.
This is a very interesting analysis, I have been wondering about this issue, the abrasion from the horse shoes and steel wheels would most likely account for a good deal of the polish on the old cobbles.
QuoteFor the uniform rust colours you may use rust powder from fresh rusted steel to give it a final touch after burnishing.
I shall do some experiment with real rust on some test pieces of rail to see how this works.
Bill
Thank you very much for those links, I particularly like the wooden one and the one under the bridge.
Quotethe stones themselves still have a very uniform overall shape compared to photos.
I agree with you, I noticed that some of the pictures show a randomness that is produced by the stones being of different physical dimensions creating gaps between them of different widths, and others that are from what appear to be from different quarries.
Quotebut the individual stones themselves are a bit more irregular in shape along all sides.
Initially I was trying to avoid most of this irregularity and attempting to make them more equal in size, in retrospect these cobbles would most likely have been subject to a fair bit of hand work by the stonemasons who prepared them. Add to that the process of the batches from the natural stone in the quarries, it really makes sense that they would not have the same sort of uniformity as the pressed ceramic or concrete type cobbles or pavers which for the most part are produced in molds and by machines.
From a purely aesthetic point of view they each produce a different sense one being a more orderly harmony and the other a more poetic one.
Striking the right balance is the name of the game it seems. The one shot of the wood setts is super I shall have to add a few of those shrinkage splits into a few of my blocks.
Michael
Quote from: michael mott on October 12, 2015, 07:27:58 AM
From a purely aesthetic point of view they each produce a different sense one being a more orderly harmony and the other a more poetic one.
Striking the right balance is the name of the game it seems. The one shot of the wood setts is super I shall have to add a few of those shrinkage splits into a few of my blocks.
This picture with the bridge in the background stands symbolically for the two possible approaches: On the left side a renewed orderly area - between the rails the more poetic part, with varying distances, settlements and even splis.
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi240.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fff181%2FPeter_T1958%2Fwww%2Fcobblestone_zpspcxasaf1.jpg%7Eoriginal&hash=d167ab3166c8f6e079384c24590e7f35cb2a9590) (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/Peter_T1958/media/www/cobblestone_zpspcxasaf1.jpg.html)
I myself would go into the direction of the more poetic one to make it even more exciting, BUT... You are pointing here on an important aspect of our hobby - the right balance! Both the more orderly aspect and the poetic one are right, it's just a question of personal preferences (In this context I still remember well the debate on Rogers Russian battleship - whether realistic or not... ;))
I'm looking forward to your next update!
Cheers, Peter
... eventually these kinda "bricks", used as paving stones on the former Feldbahn circuit at TUEV Norderstedt, could offer a modeling alternative ... instead of modeling "common" cobblestones? Because IMHO it's very difficult, to create really convincing cobblestones modelingwise ...
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.de.feldbahnmodellbau.de%2Fwp-content%2Fgallery%2F06-03-feldbahn-tuev-norderstedt%2F06-03-0006-feldbahn-tuev-norderstedt-p1010340.jpg&hash=d3fff1827a19aa234ede7f609c4d660e1cb3b058)
(https://www.finescalerr.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.de.feldbahnmodellbau.de%2Fwp-content%2Fgallery%2F06-03-feldbahn-tuev-norderstedt%2F06-03-0005-feldbahn-tuev-norderstedt-p1010337.jpg&hash=0c7e1d143dd2795021e933a15bb18ff54d591943)
Cheers
.. just found this link:
http://www.dioramadebris.co.uk/124-scale-4-wide-setts-cobblestones-mould-1240074-70-p.asp
Cheers, Peter
QuoteBecause IMHO it's very difficult, to create really convincing cobblestones modelingwise ...
Gerald I understand completely the point you make, and if I were to take the easy way out and make all the setts look like the ones you show then they would not be the type of cobbles that I want. to use a different example I could also build a wooden structure and use Northeastern scale lumber ans just paint it with barn red with no weathering because it is really difficult to make it look weathered IMHO ;)
Peter
thanks for the link, I have considered making a mould of a couple of dozen individual setts but practically I run into the same issue as the German bread only they are scattered around a bit. I have the painful affliction of being able to spot the repeating patterns in "random" pattern" wallpaper, fake stone in modern full size buildings, printed laminate flooring etc.
Once I have found a really simple way to make the setts individually with that touch of human randomness
( like these see picture at the end of this post) that only comes from doing something by hand by trying to make them the same I will have accomplished my goal and will be able to move on to some other crazy endeavor.
For you Russ
Mike
That's tasty - very nice results! Only those longitudinal scratches at some stones look a bit artificial. Unfortunately I don't find anything else for nitpicking.
Volker
Quote from: michael mott on October 13, 2015, 07:31:24 AM
QuoteBecause IMHO it's very difficult, to create really convincing cobblestones modelingwise ...
Gerald I understand completely the point you make, and if I were to take the easy way out and make all the setts look like the ones you show then they would not be the type of cobbles that I want. to use a different example I could also build a wooden structure and use Northeastern scale lumber ans just paint it with barn red with no weathering because it is really difficult to make it look weathered IMHO ;)
... your project, your rules, sisyphus ... :) ;) ... (no offense) ... I just wanted to point out, that the cobblestones have to be phenomenally good to match your excellent craftmanship (on other parts of your diorama). Cobblestones are kinda individuals (size, shape, surface), I guess you'd probably have to manufacture every single cobblestone separately to achieve the look of your favored prototype. At this stage, your cobblestones already look the part, but they appear (at least to me) still too homogeneously ... ::)
Cheers
QuoteAt this stage, your cobblestones already look the part, but they appear (at least to me) still too homogeneously ..
Love the Greek reference it feels that way sometimes.
Gerald you are absolutely correct, they do look reasonably ok but they still don't look right yet.
Once I cal get them looking the way I want without any coloring Vis a Vis the size and shape then I will get on with the colouring and fill textures. For me much of the challenge is stepping into new waters and solving the puzzles, I feel that I am heading down the right track (or hill) but there are still a lot of obstacles. "homogeneity" being one of them.
regards Michael
Michael, your latest experiment is progressing. You are getting closer to the mix of random-uniformity displayed by the prototype. Some prototype stones also had cracks and grooves in them, so that's a detail that can be included. However,right now yours appear to all be very close to the same angle relative to the long axis of the stones. Persist! you are gaining on it :)
Bill thank you for your critique it is great to get the feedback from the members who are not so close to the project.
The latest tests feel as though there is some progress. I have added a little debris and some growth. The strange thing is that by being a little less picky regarding the size selection it is getting closer to the look I am after.
Michael
Looks good to me.
Add a little dust, may be a stain or two and some wet spots and I think your there!
Really looks great to me also!
Marty
Ditto. -- Russ
Michael, sent you a PM.
Michael,
A huge progress, your efforts were worth it ... BUT ... I think your cobblestones still look too homogeneous, especially the corners (of almost each single stone) seem to be too rectangluar and too sharp-edged in comparison with your prototype. If you're gonna manage to fix that (with an additional "randomness"), the cobblestones or the whole scene respectively would be perfect ...
Cheers
Ray, Marty, Russ, Bill and Gerald,thanks for your comments they are much appreciated.
Gerald I have thought about what you describe and am going to revisit the way I am slicing the setts off the long bars of Sculpy.
Looking at the cobbles under the bridge picture there are quite a few that seem to have rounded ends so I am thinking that a number of different cookie cutter type cutters that are dull to slice them off. The dull edge causes the top to pull down a little.
This will be the next test. I get a little closer to what I am hoping to achieve with each inch of new cobbles.
Michael
Work on the new setts, I was not happy with trying to cut setts with shaped ends so took a different path.
https://vimeo.com/143099466 (https://vimeo.com/143099466)
Michael
they look a little loaf like, tomorrow once the glue is set a little surface work and I will see if they need to be made just a tad less rounded.
Michael
The first set looks like whole wheat but the second set looks moldy!
Question; How were the real ones made? like bricks in a mold and skreeted off?
May be replicating the original process in miniature might work?
-Marty
Marty one does not skreet off granite or any other natural stone. The whole wheat comment made me laugh.
Michael
Had a little time to "decorate" the moldy bread. I chipped off a few corners and did some pencil work on the colors added some wood sawdust and chalks. I am happier with the less chopped off a stick look, now they need to be a little flatter. One change at a time.
Michael
So the originals were granite?
Why not pour a slab of colored plaster, cement (or??) and split them off?
then may be a tumbler to knock off edges and polish?
Just thinkin' ;)
ytraM
Marty, I have given that Idea some thought, At the moment I do not have any cement or plaster to experiment with.
I have worked up a few more setts with less rounded tops, I am satisfied with the method at the moment. Next will come a number of tests to get the colour and debris looking right, so far all the surface debris is applied dry with no binders of any kind.
I feel pretty good about the shapes now though. I will also have to determine how much of the area to set with stone and how much to set with wood.
Michael
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Not to bomb your thread....but fwiw...this is the current state of a result I was working on
Nice work, Marc!
Marc..... didn't feel any fallout. :) It has progressed since the last image that I saw, I like the general proportions of the sett arrangement.
Thanks for posting the pictures, They show a definite set of differences in both style and manufacture.
The second and third pictures in #2 are as close to what I want to achieve, the second one shows two styles of what appear to be the same type of sett one smooth the other rough.
Although I like the first picture that you posted the setts look a lot less formal as though they were the dregs from more finished or a lot less expensive when installed.
Stone appears to maintain its original tone and shape through time though not always. I notice that some setts are set rather loosely and others more tight. I still feel that the best results will ultimately come from individual setts placed on a substrate. the trick will be for me to make a batch of convincing setts that can stand alone, vis a vis shape texture and colour, I know that I have a long road ahead yet.
It is good to sit back a while and ponder the journey.
Again thanks for the visual critique, I needed that.
Michael
Marc and Michael, What do you use for tram track?
Thanks
Narayan
Narayan the first page shows some pictures of the track and a drawing of the tool I made to roll it to the required curves.
This project is sitting atop a shelf waiting for the muse to bite.
Michael