Jacq's Logging Project Discussion

[finescalerr]

So you are "keeping your hand in this project", n'est-ce pas? --ssuR

[jacq01]

  The exhibition was a very rewarding but extremely tiring exercise..... The organisation must have used shrunken measurement tape when marking the stand as there was no room left for a table or chairs.  Standing from 8.00 in the morning till 17.00 at the show  (+ at the bar in the hotel till late at night) for 3 days was exhaustive and my legs started protesting the last day.
  I did not get a change to take photo's    as people kept talking and talking to me.

The layout was one vote short for best in show, which was won by a, for the public more understandable, fairytale / malcolm furlow type layout.  A well known occurance.

  For Jerry    the link and pins performed very very wel.  An inexperienced operator broke a link when trying to clear a derailment.  The max load on the pin was 20 white metal loaded disconnects.
 
Jacq
 

[jacq01]

  Just received this overview from a friend

  http://www.hetgroterdamproject.nl/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=694:ontraxs-2011&catid=81:diversen&Itemid=137

  at the bottom of page 3 there is a small impression.

  Jacq

[pwranta193]

I spend way too much time going bak and forth through this thread.  Jaqc, sadly much of the work spent on the rail accuracies are lost on my ignorance of the topic, but the mill operation in this is one of my all time favorites.  While I think everyone has expressed their particular favorites - the shots down the length of the mill and the little interior details really make this project sing.

I am the first of four generations in my family not to go into the wood business for life (did a short stint - but spent a career in the Army), but have been travelling around to mill sites since I was a toddler (my Grandfather managed a mill in Northern California when i was born), and then in subsequent years was dragged around by my dad and with my brothers during visits to friends running small mills all over Oregon or Washington after we moved back north.  My grampa and his brothers were some of the original partners in the old PenPly mill in Port Angeles, Washington back in the forties - and they all grew up in the woods and mills around Aberdeen/Hoquiam/Cosmopolis, Washington.  The wigwam burner was pretty much a fixture of my youth.  Sooo - while I wax nostalgic here, I guess what I'm saying is that your mill operation is one of the very few (along with Chuck's) that really give me the sense of place - and of that other time.  The number of places that I have been to where the sheer organized chaos of gear and function always amazed me, and I think it is what draws me to this project. 

Okay - enough genuflecting   
Off your laurels, sir! What is the plan for the 1:35th scale follow up project - and have you started that post yet?

Paul

[finescalerr]

I had only a moment to look through the first and third pages. (The photos of your layout are rather poor.) From what I could tell at first glance your modeling is more realistic than that of most others and, overall, it seems to have more detail. To my eye it is superior but perhaps the choice of an American prototype was less appealing to a European audience than something more familiar.

More thoughts later. Scarlett and I have to visit her parents now ... a couple of miles from Marc's house.

Russ

[danpickard]

Hi Jacq,
Unfortunate with the miss on the B.O.S label, but often seems the problem with the public voting system, with that apparent lack of understanding and apprecation for what it is they are actually looking at.  I will say though, you have the joy of getting to exhibit in some pretty good/appropriate venues for the shows (apart from the lack of seating space for the tired exhibitors feet!).  This one, and that other industrial complex you were in a while back are great settings for such an event.  The standard of the layouts also in general seem to be of a very presentable standard.  I know this is just judged from the few photos seen on the web, but compared to some other show reports I have seen (and been too locally), there are usually a good number of layouts I could walk straight past.  From the images of that show, I think I would atleast stop for a look at most of those layouts.

Dan

[finescalerr]

I have now looked pretty quickly at all four pages of photos. Perhaps the photos themselves explain part of the story: Some layouts, especially those with a lot of nice foliage or scenery, had more photos. One diorama of a village with a lot of vertical scenery we have seen on this forum before; it's not bad. I have no idea who won.

More of the photos showed your interior detail than your scenery, Jacq. Perhaps, if you were to dress up the scenery, you would earn more points with those who do not seem to appreciate the exquisite craftsmanship of your structures and interior detail.

One other thing might help the presentation: Dramatic lighting. Nobody else seems to have it.

You can't teach an idiot to appreciate quality; you must appeal to his limited taste and your craftsmanship and detail become the icing on the cake. Don't forget: Chuck Doan has walked away from some contests without so much as an honorable mention!

Russ

[Frank Forsten]

Unfortunate with the miss on the B.O.S label, but often seems the problem with the public voting system, with that apparent lack of understanding and apprecation for what it is they are actually looking at.

You can't teach an idiot to appreciate quality; you must appeal to his limited taste..

Gentlemen, the On Traxs event was a model railroad exhibition and not a finescale modelling contest. With all due respect to the phantastic master craftmanship gathered in this forum, there is more to a layout than finescale. I agree that no other layout came close to Jacq's regarding finescale engineering and level of prototypical details. But the audience took the liberty to look at the layouts as a whole thing, not just the sum of its parts. So landscape views and perspectives become as important as details or finish (weathering). I wouldn't call that as idotic or lack of understanding. Besides, at a crowded exhibition, getting close enough to the detail spots (e.g. the saw mill and the engine shed) is sometimes impossible.

The layout was one vote short for best in show, which was won by a, for the public more understandable, fairytale / malcolm furlow type layout.

My congratulations Jacq! With several thousands of visitors, one vote is very short. This is a very good result as this was a family event, not a specialists meeting. So the audience can't have been that bad, voting Jacq's mill layout as a second winner!

Acctually I like the winner layout too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0UeZOPKVLg. It is a nice piece of model railroad. I have to admit I have a weak spot for disneyish layouts ;-)

Kind regards, Frank

[finescalerr]

Frank has put this exhibition into context.

While I always have taken a dim view of the public's taste (or lack of taste) Frank's comments and link should teach us an important lesson: Pick Your Battles!

Still, if I brought a jazz band to a rock concert and became the second most popular group I would feel I had achieved an overwhelming success.

Russ

[jacq01]

if I brought a jazz band to a rock concert and became the second most popular group I would feel I had achieved an overwhelming success.

That is what I feel. 
I am very proud on the succesful introduction of this technical orientated layout. I was surprised by the enormous interest. I feel that I achieved one of my goals when a visitor remarked that he now understands the manufacturing process from log to planks.

  Jacq

[Malachi Constant]

Exactly!  The winning layout had tremendous "entertainment" value, and, considering the audience, the fact that your layout lost by only one point shows a remarkable appreciation for the fine work that you've done!  -- Dallas

[jacq01]

   Cancelled my participation to a 3-day exhibition due to a severe flu.       I hope this will end my run of bad luck.
   
   I have started with studying all the details for the skeleton cars and came across following item.

   Has it been common practice to have one truck with brakes and the other without ? 

   Which MacLeod type truck is best suited ?   T3 or T12  together with the excelent FWM wheelsets ?

   I will use link and pin ( FWM ) as they performed very well on OntraxS where one link had to be replaced.

   Jacq
     

[finescalerr]

Anything by FMW (Foothill Model Works) is superb and beyond comparison. Jerry and Scott Kitts never release anything unless it seriously exceeds the competition. So those of you wondering about their link-pin couplers might want to check out their other offerings, too. And although Jerry is a longtime friend he dropped his ad back in the '90s so my lavish praise is genuine. -- Russ

[jacq01]

I support Russ's oppinion for 100%.  There has been a good mail exchange on rolling ability of trucks and I will not be surprised if in a not too long future FWM will come with improvements for some of the present complaints.

FMW standard link and pin has been modified to fit the BM disconnects.  These are heavy white metal cars and a total of 16 cars ( 8 sets) are fully connected and connected via a drawbar and pin to one of the locomotives. For 3 days these cars rolled on and off loaded with scale 8'0" x 17'6" logs to the logdump where these logs were unloaded.  During a small mishap one link got deformed beyond repair and was replaced.
As most operators are used to Kadee or hook couplers there is a learning curve where abuse is high.
I was surprised that the damage was only one link and 4 lost pins.   

Jacq

[jacq01]

   Back to my excercises with disconnects and skeletons.

   Marc send me 2 sets of Echo Mountain disconnects.  I regauged the wheelsets and face the following problem.
   The longitudinal timbers ( in brass) are now wider than the inside distance between the back of the wheels. Grinding the timbers to fit between the wheels is no possiblity as the timber grain has dissappeared after grinding. So I started replacing all brass parts representing wood with real wood. photo's will follow later, the camera returned from a Nikon investigation as there were some mirror issues. Very good service.

Jacq